A bit more power...

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Haans
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Re: A bit more power...

Post by Haans »

A ghiaman meself,........love it.

Somewhere on this topicis was said,..that if you swop out single port for twin port heads,.....you need to change the studs ??

Tell me more about it please

Haans


Cagey
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Re: A bit more power...

Post by Cagey »

Yes Haans - it is one of the most beautiful classic shapes. It should have been a Porsche. What engine does yours have? Where can I see some pics?

Tony made the comment of the studs. Tony?
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sean
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Re: A bit more power...

Post by sean »

No No, its not only the studs. There are many other factors and parts.

Twin port even has a different engine casing. It utilises a duel relief oil system and has bigger oil ports at the oil cooler because it utilises a bigger aluminium oil cooler.

With the bigger oil cooler you need all the relevant twin port tinware, this includes the bigger fan.

Don't forget manifold, carb and all those goodies that will change.

Some will mention about making modifications and adaptors to make the single port casing work with twin ports heads, but you still going to need the ancillaries.

Best find a complete twin port motor should you want to change, but in standard form, there is not a huge amount of power difference.
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fourier
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Re: A bit more power...

Post by fourier »

Good looking Karmann Ghia you have there!

A pic of the engine compartment should help identify what the car has installed at the moment, and make suggestions a little easier. We also need to know if it has a single or dual oil relief engine case.

The car originally had a 36HP 1192cc engine, but if it now has a later 1300cc engine, there needed to have been some modification done in the past, to install the 1300cc engine in the car. 1960 and earlier Karmann Ghias had a small engine compartment (2cm shorter than later cars). There were usually two ways in which a later (physically longer) engine was fitted to an early car. The "unlucky" cars had their rear valance hacked to make space for the larger late engine, but the better solution (IMO), was to modify the rear engine tin to fill the space between the engine and the rear valance. I don't know in which way your car was modified.

If your car already has an usable, dual oil relief, dual port engine installed, you could quite easily have this engine built to provide reliable "oomph".

You could build your 1300 into a 1600 dual port using mostly standard parts. It is however not cheap to build properly, depending on the condition of what you already have, and the amount of new parts used. With a little attention to detail, and time spent on the cylinder heads, it would be capable of producing approximately double the output the car originally had, and do so reliably.

Consider upgrading the brakes, before you upgrade the engine. That's the trouble with modifying things... It never stops at just one thing.

I am going through the same process with my '59 Karmann Ghia at the moment. It had a broken 1600 dual port when I bought the car. Sadly it will never be original again, as the original engine is no longer with the car. I decided to rebuild the 1600 dual port for now, just to enjoy the car, until one day I am able to find a complete, period correct 36HP engine.

The engine had to go into the car without any sheet metal, exhaust, or crank pulley installed, otherwise it would not fit without damaging things. I am busy manufacturing a custom piece of rear engine tin between the crank pulley and the rear valance, to fit the larger engine to the small engine compartment.

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Re: A bit more power...

Post by Cagey »

Nice looking engine you have there!
OK, so here is a brief history of the car - with confusing facts... which I am uneathing with your help now only:
It was my wife's varsity car, which means my father-in-law must have bought it in ~1990. With the car he received a separate engine which - he was told - was the possibly the original engine. This engine is in storage, but I have (only) the number, which is SFAS 110202. This makes it a 1600 TP - which cannot be the original engine.
The engine it has now (still the same as 25 years ago) is an SFAD - which makes it a 1600 single port. That confuses me. Why would the previous owner have replaced a TP with an SP. (Except if he was just gooiing the spare engine in with the deal and the TP was never installed as it did not fit readily?)
Furthermore - I will need to go and inspect the SFAS engine in storage to see if it really is a TP. If so - maybe I should have the TO reconditioned and modified (conservatively) and install that in the KG. It should be able to take the 1600 TP as it currently has a 1600 SP? Except if the TP is significantly wider?
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Re: A bit more power...

Post by Cagey »

How 'bout some pics of you Ghia?
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Re: A bit more power...

Post by Cagey »

Also - the SFAD is actually SFADR - which means it was rebuilt by VW at some time?
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fourier
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Re: A bit more power...

Post by fourier »

You are correct, neither engine was original to your 1960 car.

The 1600 TP was probably bought as a spare engine, for later installation, which the previous owner never got around to doing. Although not as powerful (by a few HP), many would consider the 1600 SP to be the more reliable of the two engines, due to the tendency of the dual port version to crack cylinder heads. If set up correctly, the TP can run reliably, without cracking heads. The TP has more HP potential, if time is spent improving cylinder head flow.

If the car currently has a 1600 SP engine installed, the 1600 TP will fit without further modification. Both engines have the same length and width, with a few differences in peripherals, as Sean described above. You may need to transfer the rear engine sheet metal from the 1600 SP to the TP, if that was modified to fit the SP into the car.
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Re: A bit more power...

Post by Cagey »

Thanks.
I am in discussion with Armand (I think he was "Impi" on the forum?) to look into options. It will probably be as you said. I will need to get the old TP engine out of storage in next 2 weeks or so to visually confirm it is in fact a TP and just get a feel for condition. Then it would make sense to have that TP reconditioned, and Armand proposed the following:
1. Counterweights on the Crank
2. New oilpump
3. V100 Camshaft
4. 1776 pistons and sleeves
5. 2 x 40 Solexes
Haans
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Re: A bit more power...

Post by Haans »

That will puta bit of tilt up your kilt !!!!!
Mine can be seen on "my ride" topic on theforum,.....was still a bit dumb when I started.
Also purchased Haans with 1600 SP,......bit of a beast to put into the car,....as mentioned here it has to go in "naked",....but has since opened up the engine compartment to the dimensions of a '67 ghia with 1500 motor that I had.
So!!.....will let youknow when the engine goes in howmuch success theopening was.
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Re: A bit more power...

Post by Cagey »

This forum is confusing...I am still learning the ropes. Here I thought your name was “Haans” until Inread your thread. Also took me a while to find it as I was searching for “my ride” and not coming up with anything. Ha! But found it finally. I love the color. Its one of those colors I would not choose from a sample but looks awesome once done. Pity your project is on hold.
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