An exploration of a Type 4 motor

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stew 89
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An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by stew 89 »

In the interests of my curiosity and feeding my want for knowledge I have undertaken a little project to strip and hopefully reassemble a type 4 motor.

A few months ago I purchased 2 motors as parts for my bus should anything go wrong. The one motor, the one i will be working on, was "complete" in the sense that it was bolted together. the second having dropped a valve some time ago was in peaces and was missing a piston and a barrel for obviate resinous.

My thinking was that if i needed something I could ether find it on one of the 2 motors or barter something for the parts i need.

The problem is that every time I walked past the motor on the floor in my little workshop I kept thinking: "I wonder what is in there?" So i thought I would have a look... Over the course of this side project I will be adding to my tool collection as needed and as money allows, in the hope that eventually I will have all the tools needed to work on Graces with out having to use a 3rd party. Also hope to add to my knowledge to the same end.

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So I humbly venture forth armed with a open mind, a modest tool box and a keen thirst for knowledge. So please feel free to correct me or scold me or even throw things if I make mistakes. hopefully I will come away with a better understanding of the air-cooled VW.

Some background... I am pretty handy with a spanner and have disassembled a 1600 TP motor and my bus T4 2000 but was always to nervous I would screw up some where in the reassembly so I enlisted People to help.

the time line for this is open ended and a I will make up my mind what I will use the motor for as I go along. As far as power and so on goes Im thinking keep it stock as much as I can. I would like to get a Impi upright fan shroud for it and put it is 60s Calli style beetle or if I'm ever so lucky a Barn door panel van... (I can dream)

Ok so i started my removing the oil and fuel pump. I had never seen a T4 fuel pup before so this was interesting, what I found strange was the 3rd smaller pipe that is on the motor side of the pump diaphragm. does any one know what that is for?

Draining oil
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look at that metallic mud.

then fuel pump

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you can se the pump pushrod here

Then the carbs are next. (no picks sorry)

After that the Dizzy, this was fowled by the cooling tin so I had to remove the inlet manifolds to get the tin off. Once the dizzy was out I noticed that the part that fits into its drive off the crank had a sort of swivel on it. Is this normal?

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tins off

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the dizzy out. you can see the swivel I'm talking about in this pic

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Dizzy part number

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plugs out this is number 3 can you handle tat muck? I think this from oil fowling?

After the Dizzy the Alternator came off then the fan and fan shrouds. little side note the tin wear is un-complete and the flap that should force air through the oil cooler was forced up so I have a feeling this motor ran hot and perhaps overheated. also manny screws are missing for the tin so that would not have helped the cooling at all.

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Fan off
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next is the oil cooler. one of the studs that hold it on was not a stud but a piece of threaded rod. that cooler its self looks very clean so I think its with out leaks.
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Next is the heads.

Rocker assembly. there is some pitting on the the adjusters on the valve side. not sure if this is a problem?

Next the push rods. the inlet push rod on the #1 cylinder seems to have some scorching.
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Scorching?

than a look at the followers. they look a little worn. and one seems to have been ground down around the crown.
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The strange grind
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there are some scratches on the one on the left.


now the heads. don't forget to undo the tin on the bottom :)
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The #1 seems to have had a valve drop at some time in its life.

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the piston is fine so the last builder mad a choice to use a damaged head . the valve seats look like there seating well but we will have to see.

And thats all for Today I have to help my wife in the garden

Stew
any thing easy probably isn't worth doing.
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Re: An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by Thunder bunny »

Cool thread man. Gives me a look at what mine looks like inside too. I like the part about helping in the garden too. I'm also having to make a lot of time to work on the house etc. Enjoy man.
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Re: An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by s-thang »

stew, thanks a stack for this post!
I have a simular engine that i will be sorting in the next few weeks, but your brilliant post helps in terms of the " i am k@king myself cause I dnt know how this worx" department!
keep it up!
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Re: An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by stew 89 »

thanks guys for the kind words. Its all about knowledge :) As I get time to tinker Ill post more pics :)
any thing easy probably isn't worth doing.
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Re: An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by Harry Jones »

Please keep us posted ....thanks for all the pics !! We can all learn something here along with you

cheers
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Re: An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by stew 89 »

So i managed to do some more tinkering this last week.

I removed the other head (3-4) Again other than the carbon build up the heads seem to be in good nick.

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The number 3 piston has a mark from a dropped valve or valve seat.

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Now time to pull the Pots. There are very badly worn there is quite a large step in the wall if the barrel at the top. ( i couldn't get a nice shot of the step sorry)
I would guess that this would be the resin for all carbon in the combustion chamber, as oil would move past the rings and burn up on the piston face.

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And now the "Short Block" (sorry about the toes) :oops:

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Next the pistons come off. I used curclip players to take out the wrist pin retainers.

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Then start with the number 4 piston. i need a socket extender and gently tap the wrist pin out.

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After tying and failing to get the Flywheel off I turned my attention to heads.
these heads are square ports with the smaller intake valve. the heads look to be in very good condition apart from the velvet scars on the 1-2 head.

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looks like the exhorts port stem was letting hot gasses leaking past it on #4

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some Springs.

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some valves

and valve-less combustion chamber. this pic is upside down but there are signs of gas leakage at the 12 and 6 o'clock marks on the out sides if where the cylender would seat.

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I believe that this is because the head studs are not square in each corner of the combustion chamber. so there is a difference in torqued pressure across the face of the combustion chamber.

as you can see the valve seats don't look to bad. but the valve guide on the #3 inlet is loose and I can push it back and forth with my finger.

This is all for today. It is my turn to make supper :)

If any one dis agrees or is noticing mistakes in my way of operating or in my operations please feel free to correct me.

Regards
Stew
any thing easy probably isn't worth doing.
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Re: An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by eben »

Advice now is to lap the cylinders into the heads and install without gaskets. This was in a tech bulletin from VW. It should be on the forum somewhere.
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Re: An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by stew 89 »

Quick google search and I found this

http://www.ephotomotion.com/914engine/page29.html

Seems simple enough.

Thanks Eden
any thing easy probably isn't worth doing.
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Re: An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by s-thang »

thx for the updates~
keep them coming!
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Re: An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by snoeckie »

great thread, im going to be doing the same thing soon i just bought a 2.0 air cooled motor came out of a combi had a quick look at it today seems to have no compression on cyl 2, i want to replace my 1600tp in my beach buggy with it

it has a cu engine code anyone know if this is a type 4 motor ?
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Re: An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by Bugger »

snoeckie wrote:great thread, im going to be doing the same thing soon i just bought a 2.0 air cooled motor came out of a combi had a quick look at it today seems to have no compression on cyl 2, i want to replace my 1600tp in my beach buggy with it

it has a cu engine code anyone know if this is a type 4 motor ?
CU Is supposed to be Type 4 but I have just Built a WBX @.1 with a CU number on and the VW stamp next to it what means VW re stamped the numbers

CU Should have Square port exhaust ports as well and CU Means 2L
Adapterplates Available for Rotary in Beetle and others aswell
And Special Boxes built for Rotary Conversions and Scubies
Pierre
082 600 8663

CLick on Banner Below to be routed to the Web site

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Re: An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by stew 89 »

Thanks for the support guy. the tare down is the easy part. its funding cash to buy parts to re build that is the struggle :)
CU = 2l :)

I also got a new 3ton jack and a talk wrench this weekend so I can replace the Barrels and pistons on my Bus motor :)
I love new tools :)
any thing easy probably isn't worth doing.
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Re: An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by Tony Z »

does your new torque wrench talk to you?
New tools are cool!!
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Re: An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by vader »

You guys are strange at least I only hear voices in my head... And only when my gas mix is supper sweet do my tools talk to me....
"My other ride is your SeatCover! & She loves it!"
Sometimes you'r the statue, sometimes your the pigeon.
"Only the dead go free..." Roger Waters.
"You do not understand the power of the DarkSide" Darth Vader.
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Re: An exploration of a Type 4 motor

Post by stew 89 »

Ha ha I often hear voices :) but is Im cleaning parts then some times my tools put on a verity show :twisted:
you can tell buy the 1st pick of the thread that i may have a small substance abuse problem :drunks:
any thing easy probably isn't worth doing.
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