No 2 & 4 cylinders dead

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Sun Dec 10, 2006 2:04 pm

Hi - thought I would do a good thing and give her a service (was running fine but I CARE) and now I suspect no 2 & 4 cyl. dead - no change in engine idle when I pull the wires off the plugs. One thing that was not done during the service was to replace the condensor, but can it be that little thing? She starts easily & idles well so I think timing & other things are fine (done this many times) but there's to power & a lot of backfiring under load. Where do I start looking?? PLEASE !!!

Post by **fig** » Sun Dec 10, 2006 5:10 pm

Check your timing again. And might you have inadvertently swapped the 2 & 4 plug wires?

Establish which wire is number 1 (notch on the rim of the distributor. Then clockwise from there you should have 4, 3 and 2 to give the 1-4-3-2 firing order.

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Sun Dec 10, 2006 6:31 pm

Fig - all wires are correct. By the way - the notch on the distributor rim - where would it be normally? If I look down at the distr. (from the rear of the car) then the notch is at 3 o'clock. My literature shows it more towards 6 o'clock. This is a type 1 beetle motor with single vac distr.

La Puta!!

Post by **fig** » Sun Dec 10, 2006 6:37 pm

1-3 o'clock is about right. Have you rechecked your timing? Then check the valve adjustment again. You did adjust them cold, didn't you?

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Sun Dec 10, 2006 6:49 pm

Valves were adjusted cold and all the rest of the good stuff. In fact the car was not going badly after the service but lacked a bit of power so I checked ignition points gap (was less than 16 thou)re-adjusted, set timing again (many times) and then the problem started. If this tells you anything please let me know. No more working on la puta for today - there's a big wind blowing and she sleeps outside (could that be the problem?) so that's where I work on her.

Post by **Tony Z** » Sun Dec 10, 2006 7:00 pm

I would say your plug wires are crossed.
The Dizzy rotates clockwise looking down on it, 1-4-3-2, if you accidentaly wired it as if it were rotating the other direction, you would have crossed 2&4.
If thats not it, put your timing light on each wire just to check for spark. If nothing, then spend a few hundred bucks and replace the rotor, cap, condensor, points, leads and plugs, then you know everything is new and it all works.

As for the notch.... just make sure when you are at TDC on #1, the rotor notch and the dizzy notch line up.

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Sun Dec 10, 2006 7:16 pm

Plug wires are NOT crossed. I don't have a timing light & I have had enough of her for today. Will give it anoher go tomorrow & when I find it I will let you know. Thanks for the advice.

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 7:50 pm

Almost there - did the whole thing from the valves (cold) through ignition gap & timing & she fires on all cylinders, no backfire etc. The only remaining problem is that there's no power - almost as if she runs out of power to fast. As I said I don't have a timing light & do it staticly - could this possibly be the problem??

I'm starting to like her again (just a little)

Post by **Tony Z** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 10:04 pm

I think you may be onto your power problem....

how is it that you have judged #2&4 to be dead???

Post by **IMPI** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 8:06 pm

Dirty main jet
dead coil (they sometimes stil run but no power)
Condensor
Dirt in tank
blocked vent in tank
water in tank
dead plug wires
mis connected coil
dirt in needle and seat
Armand

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Sat Dec 16, 2006 10:38 am

Life is almost good again - got a whole bunch of stuff coming in today all the way from Gauteng (including a timing light). Back to la Puta. I pulled wires on No 2&4 cyl. & heard no change in engine idle - so I think they were not firing. As I said on Monday I did everything again - all cylinders firing & only the power thing to sort out. By the way I am not interested in building a STREET EATER (http://www.geocities.com/suicyde_vw/).

Now for the next piece of info PLEASE. Dick Muirs book mentions lots of different timing specs for same spec. motors. No idea what model (year) mine is but I do know : It is a twin port; Solex 34 P3 carb; single vac distr. & thats it. The question now is do I set timing at TDC, BTDC or ATDC?

As for:

Dirty main jet - don't know. Did feed her some carb cleaner & it did help.
dead coil (they sometimes stil run but no power) - Ouch!!
Condensor - that one will be replaced later today & then I'll know.
Dirt in tank - fuel filter loogs good - if this is any indication.
blocked vent in tank - will check.
water in tank - possible. I keep her filled up since at the coast this sometimes happens.
dead plug wires - New & checked-they are fine.
mis connected coil - No.
dirt in needle and seat - Maybe but I know nothing about carbs so this will be one of the last thing to check.

Thanks again for all the advice.
(Funny how we ignore things when they are working well)

Post by **Tony Z** » Sat Dec 16, 2006 11:05 am

I know I am pushing this, but it happened to me a few weeks ago. I got #2&4 the wrong way round. The car idled fine and even drove ok but had no power at all when needed. Thats why I am pushing this .

As for your timing.... have you got a timing light yet?
Find TDC on #1
Measure the diameter of the pulley. Using basic maths, fint the location of 26 to 28deg BTDC and mark it.
remove your vaccuum tube from the dizzy
setup timing light
rev engine until you see the dizzy has stopped advancing
keep it at this point
set the timing at this point to 28deg BTDC on #1
This sets the full advance of the dizzy and the rest will work just fine.

Just be sure you had TDC #1 correct from the beginning.

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Sat Dec 16, 2006 12:56 pm

One is 1 & two is 2 ..... - I'm damn sure the wires are fine. Thanks for the timing info - just need to clear up:

Find TDC on #1 - GOT IT MARKED.
Measure the diameter of the pulley. Using basic maths, fint the location of 26 to 28deg BTDC and mark it. - DONE.
remove your vaccuum tube from the dizzy - WILL DO.
setup timing light - TIMING LIGHT NOT HERE YET.
rev engine until you see the dizzy has stopped advancing - THIS MEANS THE DIZZY SHOULD BE ABLE TO TURN FREELY - LOOSEN NUT - RIGHT?.
keep it at this point - KEEP DIZZY @ THIS POINT?
set the timing at this point to 28deg BTDC on #1 - STATIC TIMING (engine not running) USING THE CALCULATED 28deg BTDC?
This sets the full advance of the dizzy and the rest will work just fine.

She needs to purr by tomorrow - driving some distance for west coast lobster!!

Post by **Tony Z** » Sat Dec 16, 2006 3:27 pm

remove your vaccuum tube from the dizzy - WILL DO.

setup timing light - TIMING LIGHT NOT HERE YET.
get one!!!

rev engine until you see the dizzy has stopped advancing - THIS MEANS THE DIZZY SHOULD BE ABLE TO TURN FREELY - LOOSEN NUT - RIGHT?.
loosen the clamp slightly so you can turn the dizzy to adjust the timing. Rev the engine (using the carb and accelerator cable). With the timing light attached, you will see the timing changing (thats the advance coming in), rev until your advance stops advancing

keep it at this point - KEEP DIZZY @ THIS POINT?
keep revving the car so that it remains above its mechanical advance curve

set the timing at this point to 28deg BTDC on #1 - STATIC TIMING
(engine not running) USING THE CALCULATED 28deg BTDC?
Use the timing light. with the engine at its high revs as described above, lock the dizzy in place at the 28deg mark with the full advance on. When you return the car to idle, the timing will be set at roughly 7 or 10deg depending on your dizzy. My old 1900 dizzy used to sit at 12deg at idle... I ised to time it to 30deg total adv

This sets the full advance of the dizzy and the rest will work just fine.

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 7:45 pm

Nous daar groot k*k!! Timing light on @ 28deg. when car idles so I rev it a bit & timing moves to 7 BTDC rev some more, advances somewhat but not up to 28deg. back to idle & she times @ 7deg. Shut engine off & she times 7deg @ idle & advances when reved but again not even close to 28 deg. so I shut her off again. Start her up and she times @ 28 BTDC - this is CRAZY!!

The vac adv. does work - when I suck on the pipe ign. points do move. There is also suction (vac) from the carb with throttle slightly open that I can feel.

Is this single vac. dizzy the famous 009 that does not like to live with a 34 P3 carb? The one that has a flat spot at around 2000 rpm that I also have?

Me thinks there's something wrong with the cent. advance if it has one - maybe the springs have gone or weights get stuck. There is also a lot of play on the dizzy shaft - if I lift it & let it go it falls about 5mm - is this normal?

There's something happening here
What it is ain't exactly clear...